PayPal Decides in Buyer's Favor and Refunds Money in Full

I was pretty confident that Paypal would find in my favor but even if they didn't after 25% Live.com Cashback and a 10% Paypal Coupon Code I wasn't too worried about keeping the TV since the final cost to me was only $585. The TV is still with the freight forwarder and they have been calling deligently to get this delivered. Even if I was in the area to accept shipment, based on the events leading up to the dispute it probably would have been wise not to due to the seller's return policy of requiring the item to returned via 2-Day Air, which based on the dimensions and weight of the item would cost roughly more than the item itself.

In the end, the seller didn't want to deal with me and pre-empted me by upgrading the discussion to a dispute. I would have liked the TV and tried to be nice to arrange to get it to me in time but the seller spent more time telling me to call his shipping company then picking up the phone himself and upgrading the shipping speed--probably something he didn't want to due because the cost between LTL Ground Freight and anything faster would have cut into his profit margin. It is also apparent that I am not the first customer he has attempted to manipulate by shipping a slower shipping speed then promised--just check out the reviews. Basically, I think what happened is that this reseller promises a certain shipping speed and hopes to find the product in stock in a distributor's warehouse near the buyers location. When this item wasn't in stock in this area he just shipped the most cost effective shipping speed disregarding what was listed in the auction.

In the end, Paypal found in my favor and is the process of refunding my payment in full:


We have concluded our investigation into your case and have decided in your favor.

We were able to recover $899.99 USD and this amount has been credited to you. Please allow five business days for this adjustment to be posted.

If you are due any additional funds, we will make our best effort to recover the balance from the seller.


If the seller's account has insufficient funds to complete the refund owed to you, please be assured that we will take appropriate action against the seller's account, which may include limitation of the seller's account privileges.

Seller Tries to Intimidate Buyer & Spews Propaganda

The seller didn’t like me posting the facts regarding this transaction so he sent me a little note, an Unpaid Item Reminder and submitted an eBay User Information Request. He also posted feedback to my feedback stating “Sake down! he wants $400 refund & CREATED a blog to belitte us! why keep tv then.” I never requested a $400 refund. That is a lie. I didn’t create the blog to belittle them. All of the details you seen on the previous post in red and green are the actually conversations via PayPals dispute consule—not edited. Lastly, I don’t have the TV. As was the initial discussion and the reason I ordered and paid for expedited shipping is because there would be nobody there to sign for the TV after a specific date.

Attached are screenshots of the communication from the seller today including the note, unpaid item reminder, eBay user information request and his feedback.

Note: I wasn't going to leave any feedback for the seller until he left the below threat as part of our conversation on the PayPal Dispute Console. I love how he threatens negative feedback if I leave negative feedback. I wasn't going to bother until I read that comment. I was just going to let Paypal handle the dispute and leave it at that.

* 8/5/2008 16:14 EDT - Seller: this customer is impossible to deal with!* 8/5/2008 16:13 EDT - Seller: First of all I am NOT your secutary so I will not and shell not and never will call a shipping compnay on your behalf ESPECALLIY when your phone does not work....do what you got to do and I will do what I got to do...mark this as a PROMISE...if you leave neg I will leave neg! and as a FAVOR I will escualate this for you!

Shipping Update - Ground Freight Shipping is Slower than Ground. Also, TV not in my possession.

Contrary to the sellers reply, I do not have the TV in my possession. The reason I purchased the item with Expedited Shipping was so I could ensure I would be around for delivery and it would arrive in time. If I knew the seller was going to be shipping in Ground Freight—not even UPS, DHL or FedEx Ground—I would have just purchased it from someone regionally. It would have arrived in a lot less time and I would have paid a lot less money.

Below is the shipping status. As you see it was picked up on August 1st, in transit on August 5th and had an attempted delivery on August 12th.

Status Activity*
SHIPMENT ON-HAND AT ORIGIN:
Friday, August 01, 2008 / 4:31:01 PM
PICKUP COMPLETE:
Friday, August 01, 2008 / 7:14:00 PM
CONFIRMED ON BOARD/ IN TRANSIT:
Tuesday, August 05, 2008 / 12:05:00 AM
SHIPMENT IS IN TRANSIT:
Thursday, August 07, 2008 / 4:47:00 PM
ARRIVED AT DESTINATION AIRPORT:
Friday, August 08, 2008 / 6:22:00 AM
ARRIVED AT DESTINATION AIRPORT:
Friday, August 08, 2008 / 7:37:00 AM
AT AIT DESTINATION TERMINAL:
Friday, August 08, 2008 / 9:19:00 AM
OUT FOR DELIVERY:
Tuesday, August 12, 2008 / 9:00:00 AM
ATTEMPTED DELIVERY:
Tuesday, August 12, 2008 / 10:00:00 AM

The Battle Begins - Seller Ships Item via Ground Freight Instead of Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service

As a buyer, especially on eBay, I understand that mistakes happen. Sometimes those mistakes are due to a buyer’s misunderstanding of a listing. Something those mistakes are due to a seller incorrectly or improperly representing the item for sale. What I do expect is for the buyer and seller to work together to fix any mistakes during the transaction process. As both a seller and a buyer I try to be friendly if a mistake is made and offer to assist in the issue’s resolution.

On eBay you will infrequently come across a seller that isn’t interested in working with the customer and is more interested in insulting the customer than fixing a mistake. In this blog I am going to outline such a seller. The seller, that goes by the name Directbuyelectronics, on eBay shipped a TV purchase via Ground Freight instead of the Expedited Shipping listed and paid for in the auction. I unfortunately bought from this seller because I needed a TV in a rush and the key reason I purchased from this seller is because the item listed Expedited Shipping as the shipping option. In the end, the seller just made excuses to why the item was not shipped via Expedited Shipping.

Note: Buyer said he called and e-mail but I didn't receive any correspondence before opening a Paypal dispute. He may have called but never left a message and there were no direct emails or indirect emails via the eBay Message Manager received.

Excuse #1: The TV is too fragile to ship via any other means.
Excuse #2: Expedited Shipping means we process your order quickly—not ship it via expedited shipping speed.

Under most circumstances, I would work with the seller but the seller just wanted me to fix his mistake by contacting his freight forwarding company. Honestly, I, personally, think this is his job as he selected Ground Freight as the shipping type. Also, this strategy on his part is just to pass the buck to the shipping company. Calling them wouldn’t have helped since the seller paid only for Ground Freight shipping. Are they going to upgrade to air freight for free? Are they going to speed up the semi-truck from California just for me? In both cases, I think not.

In the end, I told the seller I was tired of his lack of credibility and informed him that I would escalate the dispute to a Paypal claim when Paypal.com would allow me. Lucky for me, he got tired of dealing with me and escalated it to a claim in advance.

Below is the back and forth via PayPal:

* 8/5/2008 16:14 EDT - PayPal: Seller escalated this dispute to a Claim.
* 8/5/2008 16:14 EDT - Seller: this customer is impossible to deal with!
* 8/5/2008 16:13 EDT - Seller: First of all I am NOT your secutary so I will not and shell not and never will call a shipping compnay on your behalf ESPECALLIY when your phone does not work....do what you got to do and I will do what I got to do...mark this as a PROMISE...if you leave neg I will leave neg! and as a FAVOR I will escualate this for you!
* 8/5/2008 16:02 EDT - Buyer: Note to PayPal Staff: As you know, eBay offers 4 tiers of Flat Rate Shipping Services. The below is verbatim from eBay: Overnight Flat Rate Shipping Service (1 business day)(Get It Fast) Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service Standard Flat Rate Shipping Service Other (see description) It is apparent seller used LTL GROUND FREIGHT to ship the product purchased as part of this transaction despite the actual auction listing and the buyer paying for "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service." Moreover, the buyer purchased this item based on the auction listing "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service." If the seller was truthful in his listing and would have listed "Standard Flat Rate Shipping Service" I would not have purchased this item nor paid a premium for this product in order to have it shipped via Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service as the item was needed within a certain time frame. In the end, the seller's listing in fraudulent and while I tried to work with the seller to get the item here in a timely manner the seller was more interested in criticizing the buyer than correcting his mistake. He could have simply offered a full refund.
* 8/5/2008 15:33 EDT - Buyer: PS. You can still contact your freight forwarder and cancel the shipment. Either way I will be escalating this to issue to a Paypal dispute on 8/6/2008. Thank you for your time!
* 8/5/2008 15:27 EDT - Buyer: Obviously, I was trying to be accommodating by giving the opportunity to arrange with your shipping partner to get it here within the specified time frame but on 8/6/2008, I will proceed to escalate this dispute to a PayPal claim. We will let PayPal Representatives be the judge of whether EXPEDITED SHIPPING means ground shipping or EXPEDITED. Anyone can tell you that shipping rates are tiered based on Express, Expedited and then Ground. LTL GROUND FREIGHT is even slower than ground. Enjoy your afternoon!
* 8/5/2008 14:50 EDT - Seller: ok first I am not going to be going back and fourth about FRIEGHT or GROUND.. 2. I did what I was supose to do and your taking FREIGTH AS AIR AND MY AD DOES NOT STAY AIR. 3. if you file this to a claim then do so..I will get my money back anyway in 10days.. paypal will nto read AIR in NONE of my ads. 4. if you want to leave me a neg feedback then I will do the same AND let trust and safty know that your contact info is WRONG since your number is incorrect..( one of ebay rules and reguations on FALSE contact info) 5. UNLIKE me I was wilkling to contact you via phone to talk as men, but you want to hide behind emails. so i tried to contact you and it is noted via ebay 6. I also tried to accomadate you and your not willing but instead your read the less then 5% neg and NOT the 7000+ possitve. 7. Once u leave a negtaive I will leave one too in expressing my concerns and EFFORTS to fix this.
* 8/5/2008 11:29 EDT - Buyer: PLEASE REFUND MY MONEY IN FULL. As I mentioned, I purchased this item and paid for EXPEDITED SHIPPING in order to have the item here in a timely manner. As I also mentioned, nobody will be here to accept the shipment as of August 7, 2008, and we will not be held responsible for your freight company returning the item to you in any way shape or form. If I need to I will escalate this dispute to PayPal for review. I am sure they will find that your listing and practices to be deceiving and the fact that you have customers pay for EXPEDITED SHIPPING but ship GROUND FREIGHT (not even ground) to be unethical. I reviewed your feedback and it appears this isn't the first time you have tried to deceive a customer by having them pay for EXPRESS or EXPEDITED SHIPPING and forwarded them product via LTL GROUND FREIGHT. Buyers evaluate purchases on eBay INCLUSIVE of shipping type. Therefore, if I would have known you were going to ship via LTL GROUND FREIGHT I would have purchased an item from another seller.
* 8/4/2008 22:56 EDT - Buyer: Please refund my money in full. It you are not going to upgrade the item to the shipping method and speed paid for in the auction, as well as be uncooperative about fixing your mistakes, then I don't want to deal with your organization. You have spent more time making excuses like stating Expedited Shipping Service doesn't actually mean expedited shipping or that item is too fragile to be sent via expedited shipping. The facts are that you first said the item is too fragile to ship expedited shipping, WHICH IT IS NOT. The fact is later that you backtracked and said expedited shipping is actually your internal company lingo (shall I break out the Rosetta Stone for your auctions?) that means the item ships within 24-hours, WHICH IT DID NOT. As an organization that is charging a premium for a product within an auction that explicitly states "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service" as the means of delivery then you should take the time to fix your error. As I mentioned, the item could have been delivered at any time on Wednesday, August 6, 2008 but at this point I don't want to deal with your organization and your propensity to make excuses instead of taking the 5-minutes to fix your mistake by contacting the shipping company and upgrading the shipping speed.
* 8/4/2008 17:33 EDT - Seller: as i stated I can not act on your behalf, i dont know your schedule, times your avaliable etc...u will have to call them
* 8/4/2008 17:19 EDT - Buyer: Please see if they can coordinate having it here by Wednesday, August 6th.
* 8/4/2008 17:00 EDT - Seller: Do you want me to call the freight company to cancel the order? let me know. I can do that...and have it returned...
* 8/4/2008 16:51 EDT - Buyer: PS. Obviously, I would want a full refund if the item was returned to you. You, of course, would be refunded any Paypal fees by Paypal and eBay fees by eBay.
* 8/4/2008 16:49 EDT - Buyer: Thank you for the prompt responses, by the way. Outside of this shipping speed issue my interaction with you has been positive. If it would have shipped expedited it would have arrived in time. If it would have shipped next day via expedited handling and freight it would have arrived in time. Please contact your freight forwarder and see if they can have it here on Wednesday, August 6th. If not, you might want to have them hold the shipment and return it to you. Another key problem I have just noticed is that if I cannot coordinate to have someone here by the 23rd to inspect and accept the delivery then I would lose my Seller Protection via PayPal as this Dispute Resolution would close automatically at 8/23/2008 20:31 EDT. This isn't an ideal situation for me as a buyer.
* 8/4/2008 16:30 EDT - Seller: I am sorry..what do you want me to do???
* 8/4/2008 16:16 EDT - Buyer: Actually, I haven't received a single voice mail or e-mail from your organization until I opened this communication via PayPal. Either way, the auction specifically lists "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service" in Shipping Costs field at the top of the auction. As I mentioned, I am not trying to make difficult for you but as I mentioned there isn't going to be anyone here as of Thursday morning (August 7th) to coordinate or accept delivery for at least a couple of weeks to due to business travel for the show. Obviously, I don't want an $899 Plasma TV sitting around and collecting dust at the freight forwarders location. As well as the fact that it would have been nice to actually use the item for the show, which is why we purchased it with Expedited Shipping Service. Obviously, you should not list "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service" as the shipping type unless you are going to ship using Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service. In the auction, you can list the item will ship within 24-hours, which in this case it did not, instead of deceiving the buyer. Anyhow, contacting your freight forwarder and see if they can have it here on Wednesday, August 6th. Thank you and all of this could have been avoided if you didn't list "Expedited Flat Rate Shipping Service" in the auction. We would have known you were going to ship via Freight from the West Coast and would have selected a seller closer to our location.
* 8/4/2008 15:49 EDT - Seller: you HAVE to call AIT to schedule a dilvery date..they will not role down a street in a 18 wheeler and HOPE your there.. the only number I had to give them is the one u had registered in ebay.
* 8/4/2008 15:47 EDT - Seller: sorry that the mis-interpertation of expedited means " air shipping"...but expedited in the office means we process the order in 24hrs.. we processed the order and I am very sorry about the delay...I have tried to call you as a man to discuss my appolgies and I have left a message on your vm. We even had the order drop shipped from a closer location. My hands are tide...why this had to happen to me?
* 8/4/2008 15:41 EDT - Buyer: Last time I checked, Freight does not equal the Expedited Shipping Service I paid for and was listed in the auction. Any item, including fragile items, can be shipped via FedEx, UPS or DHL Expedited. It appears that you offer expedited shipping as part of the auction but aren't willing to actually ship it using expedited shipping. Therefore, you list expedited to differentiate yourself from other sellers but actually ship frieght. Anyhow, I am not trying to be difficult and if you can get the item here by Wednesday, August 6, 2008 then that would be great as we were planning to use the item for an upcoming show. After that date there might not be anyone around to sign for the shipment as most of our employees will be staffing the show and our office is officially closed. Expedited shipping was the key reason we purchased your item using buy-it-now. As I mentioned, I am not trying to be difficult. It just makes sense to list the actualy shipping option you are going to use instead of making excuses later. I would love to have the item here but if it can't be here in time then it might be best just to refund our purchase. As I mentioned earlier, I have no problem accepting a eBay Item-Not-Paid Dispute to nullify the transaction and refund your eBay fees. Also, I don't want to see the item arrive when nobody is here to sign for it.
* 8/4/2008 15:10 EDT - Seller: call them to see if they can deliver any sooner...
* 8/4/2008 15:07 EDT - Seller: sorry greg..but as you can see it went FREIGHT not ground..the tv is too fragial to go on a fedex or ups truck...the tv shipped from our location on the 31th. Can you please close the dispute of if you do not want the tv please let me know and I will have to turned around. thanks..u can call me too at 310-709-8887
* 8/4/2008 14:59 EDT - Buyer: Thank you for the tracking number but I would like to know why the item is shipping via Ground Freight instead of the Expedited Service I paid for as part of the Buy-It-Now auction? I paid a premium based on the listed expedited shipped service. If you are going to ship via freight you should accurately reflect that as part of your auction. Buyers evaluate the total purchase price including accurate shipping methods. AIT lists pickup at their NEWYORKJFK station on August 01, 2008 but estimated delivery in NJ (less than 50 miles away) on August 08, 2008.
* 8/4/2008 14:26 EDT - Seller: Greg the item shipped within 3 business days you should have your unit friday. shipped via AIT WORLD WIDE::: TRACKING NUMBER *******
* 8/3/2008 20:31 EDT - Buyer: Please refund in payment full. Item not shipped in a timely manner. Purchased item with expedited shipping as this item was needed immediately. Feel free to forward eBay Unpaid Item notice for refund of any eBay fees associated with this auction. Thank you!